User talk:Legoless/Arc 2011d

This is an archive of previous comments on my talk page. Please do not post a message here - use this link to go to the active page instead.

Independent Thievery

Hey Lego! Since we almost have nothing to do around here, I decided to make a page for the Independent Thievery quest - the ton of tips are clogging up the Thieves Guild page, so I figured we could make it more attractive by splitting it up a bit. Question to you is: Are you able to make a table of Journal Entries? If yes, just go ahead and create the page. If no, just say the word. 1 month to go... ;) --Krusty 09:18, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

I've made a go at it here. The quest ID can be found above the table - don't accidentally paste it onto the article. --Legoless 11:54, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! I'll copy/paste it into one of my own Sandboxes just to see what kind of page I can make from the existing information. As for the quest ID, we'll see about that when it is time to launch. --Krusty

Gray Cowl

Hey, I noticed you removed the edit about the nocturnal cowl even though it's one of the simplest and usefull ways of killing him without the player being detected and gaining bounty. Just thought it should have stayed on there as I'm sure many people would find it usefull Do you like the music of Shawaddywaddy? 22:35, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

It's better to keep Cowl notes to a minimum. If we added it to the Permanent Retirement article, we'd have to add it to all articles. If you'd like a second opinion, please feel free to bring this issue up with the community on the article's discussion page. --Legoless 22:50, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

New potion

I have come across a potion which I can not find anywhere on the site called: Deadly Poison (bypasses poison. I'm assuming the end has been cut off, as it's the same text from poisoned apples. I have no idea how I made it but I did. It is a potion, not a poison and the effects are: Deadly Poison (bypasses poison resistances) for 1 sec on Self. Do you have any idea where this came from or any uses?? Thought you might have an idea Forgive Nex 23:20, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

You probably combined a Poisoned Apple with another script effect ingredient (e.g. Rat Poison). It will have the same effect as eating a poisoned apple, but it likely weighs more than zero, meaning it can't be pickpocketed. See this section for more info. --Legoless 23:40, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Province maps for cities

We shouldn't add images to articles just because they "might need one". We need to add appropriate images to appropriate articles. The Morrowind image doesn't even have Gnaar Mok labeled on it, so continuing to have it is just pointless. I plan on removing the rest of the images where there is no relevance (cities where they aren't on the map). Spamming images just for filler is unprofessional and lazy. Elliot (talk) 01:51, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

If you would like to discuss the current format of lore pages, please do so before reverting. I and other editors have been following the standard for a while now, so creating an edit war is both counter-productive and out of standard, properly defined or not. The map is there to illustrate the article, not to provide a visual location. --Legoless 01:56, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

If we are going to discuss this I believe a redundant or unnecessary image is better than none at all. The lore articles need a bit more color in them. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 01:57, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Check Your Mail

Check your E-Mail as soon as you get a chance, I sent you a message. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 17:13, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Claims of vandalism?

I received a message from you (although it looks like an automated response) warning me not to vandalize any more pages. I have only made one edit to this wiki which was a simple correction of a mistake on the page for Shivering: Split. Suddenly, I'm being blamed for "vandalizing" a page, however the information I used was based of the in-game map and information from this wiki. Even though my edit is claimed to be vandalism, there is no evidence that what I posted was incorrect and no one has even made an attempt to change the page since I edited it. I would at least like some form of explanation as to why I received this warning. 98.231.229.83 21:43, 7 August 2011 (UTC)184.76.72.239

I've responded to your email. It's nothing unique, we've been having the problem for a while now. --Legoless 23:39, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for the quick reply and clearing up the situation. 98.231.229.83 17:40, 12 August 2011 (UTC)98.231.229.83

Goblin Time!

Hey Lego! I figured you could help me out here. I just started working on the usual OPRP-stuff for Derelict Mine and encountered this often-discussed situation with invading White Skin Goblins. Puzzled by this, I read through the Goblin page, where we clearly state: “The only wars that occur without a mod are the ones in the Goblin Trouble quest.“ This is obviously untrue, but reading through the mentioned talk page made me realize that this unique(?) phenomenon remains a mystery. So:

• Will the White Tribe Goblins spawn in Derelict Mine EVERY time you enter – and will they respawn?
• Will they spawn if you cleared Goblin Jim’s Cave for White Tribes?
• Will Goblin Jim’s Cave miss the Goblins that spawned in Derelict Mine in if killed them?
• How to describe this thing on the Goblin page?

Of course, I could test these questions the hard (and very time-consuming) way, but I hope you can answer just a few of the questions., just to save me some trouble. Thanks in advance! --Krusty 14:20, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

I looked into this on several occasions, and it's quite the puzzle. I'll have a look in the CS, but I've personally encountered the White Skin raiding party outside before, in between both caves. My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I believe they had reclaimed the totem staff and were heading home, with some Sharp Tooth goblins pursuing them. If the tribe raiding system strays too far into scripting, I'm afraid I won't be able to help much. In-game testing is likely the best course of action. --Legoless 17:03, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

I see. I figured it was fuzzy, because it is impossible to find anything interesting on the talk page - it WOULD be interesting to know how they spawn, though. And I think the CS can help with that. Problem is, I can't really finish the place page without knowing a bit about what is going on, so if you can't find anything, I'll have to kill me some Goblins. For now, I'll just go through Goblin Jim's Cave, if not for anything else, then to finish his NPC page. --Krusty 17:11, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

Okay, after Mxk101 mentioned he didn’t see any fights going on in Derelict Mine, I made a few tests, just to get it out of the way. I simply loaded my Lvl 1 save, right after the sewers, and traveled to Derelict Mine. No White Skins to be found, despite the presence of the Totem (I had a crazy theory about the Totem spawning at higher levels, but screw that). THEN, I figure, ‘maybe you have to add both Goblin Jim’s Cave and Derelict Mine as map markers for this to happen’, so I went to see the guys in Skingrads Fighters Guild, and got my map markers for the two caves. Returned to Derelict Mine, but still no war, no White Tribes, no nothing. Need something to go on, otherwise I’ll have to change all my Goblin War statement so they start with the annoying word “may”, which is below Wiki standards. Hopefully, someone else will jump aboard this investigation, because I’m getting stubborn. --Krusty 23:24, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

Alright, it seems that the war chief has AI packages which send him looking for the shaman staff if it's stolen as long as the shaman isn't dead (not sure what the conditions are, but it has to do with a script variable unique to the tribe - I think if it's moved at all, or at least taken from its starting cell, he will go look for it). The leader will pick up the staff and bring it back to an invisible marker inside the cave (probably where the staff usually is - I didn't visually check).

Other goblins follow the chief. Berserkers are the soldiers; they follow him until his death, at which point they will return to their usual location after the fighting is finished. The skirmishers patrol the cave, but will follow the war chief if they have nothing to do and he's leading a recovery mission. They can also put the staff back in its correct place, but I don't really understand how they'd get it. It seems to me that they need to be in the cell where the staff is held to pick it up, although the ones I looked at were in the second zone of Derelict Mine (rather than the third), so they probably couldn't help. Chefs and caveguards are useless in a raid. The shaman freaks out a bit and extends her range of wandering by ~1000 feet (whatever that is in-game I couldn't tell you).

Now down to the interesting stuff. The White Skin's tribal head, GoblinHeadJim, is in the second zone of Derelict Mine (on one of those plateau-type formations, with the natural bridges across a chasm). This is the location where I saw the mass of warring goblins which almost crashed my game. The Sharp Tooth staff, GoblinHeadDerelictMine, is in the third zone of Derelict Mine like it should be. This has an interesting effect on Goblin Jim: seeing as how his staff is missing at the start of the game, he always uses his "head lost" package, which increases his wander range tenfold. This explains why I've encountered him all over the cell, in different places each time I visited. His standard package would only activate if the White Skins won and "reclaimed" the staff. The staff would be placed in a stable-like structure in the third zone; this is Jim's editor location, so he would likely wander near it after his range gets reduced.

I'm kind of unsure about the Sharp Tooth's intentions. It appears to me that they will bring their own staff to the location in zone two, where the White Skin staff is initially placed, if it gets stolen by the player. But based on the editor names (the marker being DerelictMineEnemyHeadMarker2) I'm inclined to wonder whether the Sharp Tooths are actively attempting to steal and keep Jim's head. Another investigation in the CS might reveal the details to a more experienced editor, but I think in-game checking would be the absolute best option at this point. --Legoless 01:20, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Edit: Oops, I forgot to answer the specific questions you asked above. The White Skin invaders don't spawn in Derelict Mine; they come with their war chief. This will clear up the former three questions. As for the last one, I'm not quite sure how to eloquently put this rambling into some generalised, perhaps even readable, content for the goblin article. I'm not sure where the conflict belongs, actually. I guess a paragraph could be devoted to it on the goblins page, and then the place articles could contain the specifics about how it effects each cave. Goblin Jim might also need some work. --Legoless 01:25, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Whoah, that’s a lot! As I have a hard time deciphering all the CS-stuff, let alone come up with ideas on HOW to test this, I think we could use a second CS-look – unless of course, you can give me some exact pointers on what to test. ;) I’m 99% certain we have another Unfinished Quest here (which would explain why both Parwen and Ah-Malz will point you towards these two goblin lairs + the fact that Skingrad citizens will talk about their fascination with killing Goblins). Nevertheless, thanks for looking into this. I just took a quick look and managed to have a single White Skin survive the battle and slowly wander back to Goblin Jim’s Cave, which means that the statement on the Goblin page is a false and a war of some sort is going on. Incredible that this game still contains stuff to be discovered. --Krusty 08:59, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

For testing, I would recommend watching the goblins war over and over to get a feel for each outcome. See what happens if the White Skin totem staff is reclaimed. A 100% chameleon suit and some heal other spells could help you insure your favoured side's survival, although this sort of testing would be much easier on PC. Also, if you could eliminate the White Skin's war chief before they got to the mine, then you could try stealing the Sharp Tooth staff and leaving it somewhere nearby, to see if anyone goes after it and where they put it once retrieved. --Legoless 15:04, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

Hmm, time for me to look into this, I think.

• I'll start by determining exactly WHEN the Whites leave Goblin Jim's Cave for their Totem. They wasn't in Derelict at my lvl 1 save (that's why I went through all the trouble talking to the Skingrad people for map markers), but they should leave at some point. Does the CS says anything about that at all - or is it totally random?
• Next up, I'll try to keep the White War Chief alive and make him claim the Totem, just to see if that's what he is after. Problem is, some of the other Whites tends to pick it up, so I'll have to solve that somehow.

In any case, a Goblin War outside the Goblin Trouble quest is more than worth mentioning on the Goblin page, so I'll take a Goblin day tomorrow! Let me know if you think of anything else. By the way, what about the info on the drunken Goblins? I forgot (again), but it should be carefully placed somewhere on the Goblin page as well. --Krusty 23:29, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

The war party leaving the cave should happen whenever the goblins' AI packages kick in, so it's probably quite random. Regarding the drunk goblins, I think the "Dead" section of the page would be a good spot, although putting them higher up nearer the tribes might be worth considering. --Legoless 23:56, 14 August 2011 (UTC)

I'll take a look at the war (and the Goblin page) tomorrow. I added the dead Goblin-info to the 'Dead'-section on the pgae, but the layout is a bit weird. Oh, and if you can find anything remotely interesting to write here you're more than welcome. What a boring place! --Krusty 00:11, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

(←) Gah, I hate to admit it, but I'll have to pass on this one for now. For a PS3 user, this is an almost impossible task. You have 20 nearly identical Goblins fighting and ONE War Chief who can die at any moment. I have attempted this five times now, with 100% cham and everything and the chaotic battle is simply impossible to control. Even worse, I can't even check the "departure time" on Level 1, because the buggers will attack me on sight and I can't cheat my way to 100% chameleon. Seems like a PC user kind of deal. Dammit! --Krusty 22:23, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

Coast Guard Station

Hey Lego! I went through the unused files and saw an image for the Coast Guard Station and decided to create a page for it. Now, I could use a bit of help/advice, maybe even some proofread. If you look in my sandbox here, you will notice that I was able to ramble a lot more than I thought, so maybe you can read through it and exterminate the most idiotic rambling? Also, the Summary box looks a bit awkward, but I simply can't figure out in which region the Station is located. Maybe the CS is clearer? It also lacks the console code. Hope you have the time - and thanks in advance! --Krusty 09:42, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Ah well, rpeh added location code and region, so I just launched the page. Still needs a bit of proofread and CS info, though! --Krusty 10:09, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

That image had been annoying me for a while now. I'll give it a look at in the CS. --Legoless 13:00, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Camps or something else?

Hey Lego! No, I'm not here to try and speed up our camp project, as I'm suddenly busy with everything but camps. Still, I noticed a few interesting ones during my 'countless travels' - I figured you could see what they're called in the CS, just to find out if they qualify as Unmarked Camps. It's this and this. What do you think? --Krusty 22:21, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

I've thought about those dungeon camps before, and I've reached the conclusion that they should be covered in the "Exterior" section of the dungeon article. All the info is there, and creating a separate page for them seems superfluous. Plus, if we started adding ramblings about one dungeon entrance we'd have to do it for all of them. --Legoless 22:25, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Fine with me, it was just a thought. I've never even checked how many "dungeon camps" we have, but if it is a LOT, then there's no real need. Problem with the OPRP place pages is, that there's not really room in the current layout for a "human" description, just a bunch of facts (like this). Still, we have more than enough to do so let's keep it at that. :) --Krusty 22:32, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Citation Needed

I have like two minutes to do this so I don't have the time. Go under a Dunmer NPC in the CS, open up the dialogue window, go to coversation, go to recent events (Something like that). I have to run but that's where the citation for those rumors is. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 17:21, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

I checked CurrentEventsResponses and TamrielGateResponses, with no luck. I can't find anything about Blacklight. --Legoless 17:27, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

It seems that you're right, I can't find a citation for the note on the city of Blacklight. I couldn't even find any mention of Blacklight in any line of dialogue from the text document rpeh sent me. A secondary check for anything to due with the Redoran revealed that there appears to be no note of anything about their capital being mentioned in any piece of dialogue in Oblivion. Mind you I was only trying to point you in the right direction as I was in a hurry. I didn't have the time to confirm this myself. On a side note, it might be worth compiling all generic rumors and such onto an article on the wiki that we'd be able to cite as needed (I'm not entirely sure one doesn't already exist though). This could really make issues like this a bit easier to resolve. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 02:26, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

I'm not sure exactly what you're talking about, but there are no references to Blacklight in OB dialogue. There's the following in MW, though:

• "I heard Larienna has left Vvardenfell. She's allegedly looking for an unplundered Dwemer ruin near Blacklight. Some work unfinished I think." - Hrundi, after the Battle at Nchurdamz quest.

There's also a very brief mention in On Morrowind, but that's it. rpeh •T•C•E• 08:05, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

I had recently added a "citation needed" tag on Lore:House Redoran due to an unsourced claim of the Redoran having been forced to move their capital to Blacklight after Ald'ruhn was sacked, which appeared to be a rumour from Oblivion. I'll go ahead and remove it if the source can't be found. --Legoless 12:55, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

You can remove the reference for now if you wish, but I'll check through to see if I can find an exact quote. Do we know who added that note to the article in the first place? Maybe they have solid evidence on the subject? --OblivionDuruza 14:47, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

User Wolfrah added it at the end of 2009. He only has two other edits, and I'm doubtful of their validity as well. I've removed the statement about Blacklight, although the article still needs to be re-written from a lore perspective. --Legoless 14:57, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

I've removed one of the others. The one on the Hlaalu page has already been rewritten. rpeh •T•C•E• 15:19, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

While I agree with the removal of the line on agriculture, I'm not sure I understand your reasoning left in the edit summary. In Oblivion, it's mentioned that slavery was abolished by Helseth, and Dres and Redoran are ruined by opposing this decision. --Legoless 15:34, 19 August 2011 (UTC)

Haynote Cave

You've undone a few important edits I did on the Haynote Cave, specifically noting (with an updated map) the underwater chests. Yes, they were already on the old map, but in line with the OPRP I was adding content to explain further, since they were not identified as underwater in the description or the map. It's fine with me if we leave it as it is, I know a lot of folks have their egos caught up in wikis and as a rule I never, edit them unless it seems important. But it was a good edit, with a new, clearly marked map, and people visiting the wiki would have found it helpful. It's going to be tough to get the OPRP running smoothly if people don't like new edits. Cheers. Morgaledh 16:45, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

My reply can be found here. --Krusty 17:26, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

Unfinished Business

Hey Lego! Just noticed you corrected a typo in my Sandbox. Mind if I ask you what you think about the page? I can't really decide if it's clumsy or poorly worded, so feel free to edit and reword if you think it can be better. Thanks! --Krusty 22:08, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi Krusty. I hadn't time to proofread it when I made the typo fix (I had just popped in due to your most recent edit summary). I've just gone through it now and made some very minor changes. I can't see any problems with the article, and I like how it links in with Modryn's page and the Fallen Rock walkthrough. I'm not too sure what the bug note is trying to say, but other than that it looks ready for publication. --Legoless 13:57, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks mate - page launched! The bugs section tries to explain the ton of rumors that will spread in Chorrol, regardless of how you choose to take credit for the diary. Not much to do about it, as it is quite impossible to list all of them. :) --Krusty 18:11, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Blackheart?

Hey Legoless! I juust noticed the added dialogue to Modryn Oreyn’s page – and found the entire thing in my dialogue sheet; apparently there are two possible replies when you report back to Modryn: "A journal? Sounds like he fought bravely. I should have known the Blackheart Company was involved. Reckless amateurs!" and "A journal? Let me see that... Blackwood Company! Bastards! Rank amateurs!", which is the one I used on his page. Both replies will end with: "I don't like to think how Vilena is going to take this news. He was my responsibility. I'll be the one to tell her. I want you to lay low for a while. Talk to Azzan or gro-Khash. Let me deal with Vilena. You've still got a career ahead of you."

Can you check the conditions for the “Blackheart” response? That would save me quite a bit of time… ☺--Krusty 18:30, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

This is what I found:

"Dead? Dead! What happened? A journal? Let me see that... Blackwood Company! Bastards! Rank amateurs!":

Quest stage = 30

(Completes quest, removed journal)

"Dead? It can't be! What happened? You didn't think to find some evidence? Get back there. Find out what went wrong, dammit!"

Quest stage = 20

"A journal? Let me see that... Blackwood Company! Bastards! Rank amateurs!":

Quest stage = 30

Stage 25 is complete

(Completes quest, removed journal)

"A journal? Sounds like he fought bravely. I should have known the Blackheart Company was involved. Reckless amateurs!"

Quest stage = 30

Stage 10 complete(?) - equals 25

(Completes quest)

I don't understand the conditions for the "Blackheart Company" line. I'm guessing that the requirement for stage 10 completion to equal 25 is a mistake, because in all other instances it's supposed to equal 1 (meaning StageDone is true). This makes me doubt whether it shows up in-game, but how else would that note from the quest page get there? Unless someone was casually skimming through the CS dialogue (or this sheet I keep hearing about). The line also doesn't remove the journal from the player's inventory, which makes me think it's unused. Feel free to remove that dodgy quotation from Modryn's article - at least until it's sorted out. --Legoless 19:02, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

Okay, I took yet another trip to Forsaken Mine (two, actually) and added the rest of the in-game dialogue. The "Get back there"-line was not on the page, due to me being a rank amateur. As for the Blackheart dialogue, I'm 99% certain it is unused. There are only two ways to trigger dialogue from Modryn - when you find the corpse, you can return and listen to the "Get back there"-dialogue - and when you pick up the journal he will say the "Rank amateurs"-line (with/without the "Dead? Dead!"-intro). The Blackheart line could be added as a note, but then again... maybe the page is big enough already? I'll put it on the talk for now. --Krusty 19:46, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

Guard House

Hey Lego! Yes, me with yet another annoying request! Recently, I created a page for Guard House and it turned out okay. Still, it needs the usual CS-work – and as the house is really odd (maybe one of the best free houses?) I’m eager to see if there are any safe containers in there. If you get the time, can you take a look? No rush or anything - and thanks in advance! --Krusty 23:13, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

I'll try to take a look soon, but I'm busy with schoolwork so it mightn't be till the weekend. --Legoless 22:12, 7 September 2011 (UTC)

I've done the CS check and added the missing info. --Legoless 22:04, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! One can't help but wonder why this building is unused - but it was nice to get the article up and running. --Krusty 22:12, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Quick question

First, thank you for that edit on the Frostcrag page. I'm new here, and I'd like to learn a few tips and tricks so I can contribute better for when Skyrim is released (yay!). My question is, if you'll look back on that particular line you edited of mine - was the way I phrased the sentence (leaving out the explicit details) the correct way to write secondary/tertiary wiki articles? I felt that since it wasn't Aurelinwae's page, I shouldn't reveal everything - specifics about her name/location/purpose etc. She has her own page, after all.

Oh, and is this^ a good use of a talk page? If not, why? It's a little confusing. — Unsigned comment by 118.93.190.187 (talk) at 23:56 on 8 September 2011 (GMT)

I assume this is user Climberat. The purpose of a user's talk page is for other users to contact them, so yes, this is certainly the correct way to use one - just remember to post new discussions at the bottom of the page and to sign your comment with four tildes (~~~~). You are correct that one should avoid adding duplicate info to articles, as, like you said, that's the purpose of the NPC's own page. The list of features on the plug-in pages is just to summarise what they add, so it isn't even necessary to mention Aurelinwae's name, as a simple link would suffice and provide all the relevant info. You'll notice that I removed the note on Khafiz that you added to the Thieves Den page, as the merchants were mentioned in a note above. Don't take this advice as a written rule, however; the plug-in pages aren't all that great, so there's always room for improvement. --Legoless 13:31, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

thanks. And oops :P --Riandrake 00:45, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

Image description

I'm getting a bit fed up with the fighting over the description of this image. Please can you link to where you got it so we can sort it out? rpeh •T•C•E• 23:08, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

I believe I was mistaken, and it was this image which was of the Redguard. 71.197.122.141 corrected my mistake originally, and I've removed the image summary to avoid further confusion. I can't find a source for the info, or I would have double checked when uploading originally. --Legoless 23:40, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Wallpapers

Please can you take a look here. rpeh •T•C•E• 17:35, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Should I link to the exact image, or would this suffice? Also, I got the Shadowkey images off a dodgy wallpaper site and I can't find their original source; what should I do? --Legoless 17:41, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Linking to that page should be fine - the way Beth change their site around means it'll all change eventually anyway. Which SK images do you mean? rpeh •T•C•E• 17:49, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

They're based on the three promo posters, one of which is on Shadowkey:Shadowkey. They seem legit, but I suppose they could be fanmade. Google seems to have at least two sizes in its search archive, but I could only access the bigger (1600px). I'll upload them now so you can take a look, but feel free to remove them again if you have doubts. --Legoless 17:52, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Edit: Here they are. --Legoless 18:00, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Tricky. If it's a really dodgy download site, down link. If it's even semi-legit it should probably still get the link. The copyright on the image is good though. rpeh •T•C•E• 18:30, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

This is the site I got the cover wallpaper off. Doesn't seem trustworthy to me, but I haven't noticed any drivebys yet so I'm not condemning it completely. Here and here is where I got the other two, but the actual site seems to be down. What do you think? --Legoless 18:35, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

On the same note, should we have an alternate esimage licence template for Vir2l, for use on "Travels" images? Looking at the copyright on those wallpapers, I can't see any mention of BethSoft. --Legoless 18:43, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

(←) Okay, I just made some adjustments to {{esimage}}. By itself it yields:

This image was taken from the Elder Scrolls series of video games or from websites created and owned by Bethesda Softworks, the copyright of which is held by Bethesda Softworks. All trademarks and registered trademarks present in the image are proprietary to Bethesda Softworks, the inclusion of which implies no affiliation with the UESP. The use of images to illustrate articles concerning the subject of the images in question is believed to fall under the fair dealing clause of Canadian copyright law.

...but {{esimage|Vir2L}} yields:

This image was taken from the Elder Scrolls series of video games or from websites created and owned by Vir2L, the copyright of which is held by Vir2L. All trademarks and registered trademarks present in the image are proprietary to Vir2L, the inclusion of which implies no affiliation with the UESP. The use of images to illustrate articles concerning the subject of the images in question is believed to fall under the fair dealing clause of Canadian copyright law.

Hope this works for you! Elliot (talk) 22:53, 18 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, that's great! I've changed the three wallpapers to use the new license, and eventually all of the Travels images will need to be swapped over as well. --Legoless 21:18, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

Quick Question.

Sorry to bother you, but I just wanna ask why did you undo my edit on the Skyrim Talk page? Fin Dova Feyn 08:55, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

Those look like they're photos of a magazine article. That's a copyvio, and even linking to that kind of thing is a bad idea. rpeh •T•C•E• 09:07, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

Oh, okay. Thank you for your time, know I know not to post things like that.Fin Dova Feyn 09:12, 19 September 2011 (UTC)

No dates on vampire lore notes- you sure?

My concern is claiming more than I actually know, and I wasn't sure I could consider the regional demographics of vampires during Daggerfall to be a constant. Over two hundred years in game time have gone by (once Skyrim's out) since we got info on these places. In that time, we know that the Empire has all but disbanded, Argonians have take over mainland Morrowind, everyone on Vvardenfell died, and the Dunmer have effectively replaced Nords on Solstheim. And that's not even accounting for the drastic cultural changes which must have been precipitated by the Miracle of Peace immediately following the events of Daggerfall. People move, get driven away, and die off, even vampire families.

Am I laying it on a little think? I'm not trying to complain, really, omitting dates just makes the job easier; I just want to be crystal-clear on details before embarking any further on this mini-project of updating the Iliac Bay region lore pages. Already had one false start. Minor Edits 21:50, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Our only reliable information comes from the time of Daggerfall, true, but there's no real reason to doubt its validity in 200 years time. The regions themselves probably don't exist anymore due to the Warp in the West. The whole article is essentially dated. If we were going to specify its time period it would make the writing a lot harder; I can't think of any way of doing it, currently. Lorespace will probably need a lot of tweaking to fit with Tamriel's "current" timezone once Skyrim is released -- in fact, most articles haven't even caught up to the novels yet. You might want to ask about this on the community portal if you'd like some ideas, as I'm quite blatantly stumped as for what to do. --Legoless 22:09, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Nah, sounds good. Leave dates off, maybe update later as necessitated by Skyrim. Minor Edits 22:16, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Feeding Time

You have been given a plateful of cookies! I haven't given out any tasty treats for a while, but having done some baking it's pretty clear that you need to be amongst the first recipients. It's difficult to mention anything specific because you've been active all around the site: the Lore pages are much better thanks to your input, you've been an incredibly active patroller, and you've even found time to create a whole new section of the site on your own. A plate full of cookies is the least I can give you as a thank you. All I can ask is that you keep up the good work. rpeh •T•C•E• 23:16, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, rpeh! My contributions have been slowing down recently due to school, but I'll become more active again come midterm. --Legoless 16:14, 30 September 2011 (UTC)