User talk:Bewing

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Feel free to practice editing in the sandbox or discuss the games in the forums. If you need any help, don't hesitate to contact one of our mentors. Have fun! —Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 01:25, 20 December 2012 (GMT)

Oblivion:Horses

Hello and thank you for your interest in the UESPWiki! However, a lot of your edits to Oblivion:Horses are not that useful to the average person due to the different ways a person will play the game. For example, the table you added that compared speeds of different creatures across the bridge is not going to be very helpful due to the game mechanics. Saying that a "typical" human can cross the bridge in 27 seconds is fairly hard for a random user to determine the validity of your experiment, since your speed, athletics, and race are not mentioned. For the same reason, comparing different horses speeds is also not useful since we already state the actual base speed of different kinds of horses on the article. I have also found issues with your testing, such as with your claim that horses cannot drown. I have had horses drown on me by going underwater on them before, so from my own experience, your removal of that note was erroneous. I also found your versions to be much less formally written than it was in previous revisions. Your discussion on things like "superhorses" to describe horses with buffs cast on them is the kind of vernacular that can make an article come off as less than professional.

As I have already said, I appreciate your desire to help the wiki, and please do not take this as a suggestion you should stop editing. Instead, I may recommend that you try sandboxing articles that you intend to make editions to, and opening them up to peer examination. If you have any questions, feel free to ask! --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 23:35, 28 September 2013 (GMT)

I half agree and half disagree with what you say. I wish you had posted the point about having horses drown on the talk page where it is in question during the last 7 years, because *I* certainly have never had it happen, and nobody else had made such a comment. Please put the drowning comment back, or I will. I apologize that I removed accurate info -- I have edited other wikis, and I try very hard not to make that mistake. The other half of that sentence about having it be "difficult" to get a horse back to the surface is certainly BS, so I guessed that the first half was equally so -- especially since I could not reproduce it after jumping my horses into water literally thousands of times. I would really like to know how you managed to drown a horse, actually.

The ratios of the horses speeds is *very* important to know, because otherwise you have no idea what you are buying with your 5000 coins. The "speed" attributes of the horses listed on that page do not tell you that a black horse is exactly twice as fast as a paint horse. And they do not tell you that a superhorse is 4 to 5 times faster than a black horse. You *need* that kind of info in order to make decisions in the game, and that is the point of a wiki (as opposed to experimentation). The fact that the article only discussed the speed differences with vague handwaving was a serious lack in the article, and I had a definite purpose when I tried to add some hard data on it. Perhaps we can agree on a better presentation format. But forcing readers to guess how much faster a horse is than a PC is uncool.

So sorry you don't like the "superhorse" appellation, and yes, I admit I was being lighthearted with that commentary. It can be toned down, certainly. However, I think the point stands. If you put a wayshrine blessing on a horse, it is not merely a buff. It is permanent, it is much bigger than anything you can do with a spell (I have tried), and it *completely changes the experience of riding that horse*. If the main point of a horse is its speed, and then the speed changes by a factor of 10 when you do this thing, can you not see that you've completely changed its major feature?

The problem with sandboxing is that I am finding that this Oblivion section of the wiki has been basically unmaintained for the last 4 or more YEARS. Sandboxing is only useful if someone will actually READ it. The list of recent wiki additions is entirely Skyrim -- and the errors in the Oblivion wiki are just sitting there, forever.

Looking forward to the favor of a reply Bewing (talk) 07:34, 29 September 2013 (GMT)

The purpose of the sandbox isn't for people to read it. It's so you can work on your own things without interference from other editors. Making sandbox edits is actually an excellent idea in this case, as you could get input on what parts of your edits could use improvement rather than just having them reverted. As for speed "ratios", those are also unimportant because we already list the speed of horses on the article, so anything else would be redundant, and we have a policy about not including redundant information. Hope this helps! ThuumofReason (talk) 11:15, 29 September 2013 (GMT)

"The purpose of the sandbox isn't for people to read it" -- "as you could get input ..." <-- this is obviously self-contradictory.

"we already list the speed of horses on the article" -- paint horse speed = 23, black horse speed = 32. Explain to me how you can tell from this info that a black horse is twice as fast as a paint horse. You can't, in fact. The "speed" numbers quoted in the article are worthless, because they are not comparable to anything else, and the relationship is not linear. Providing worthless "information" in the article helps nobody. That is precisely what I am complaining about. If a horse's main feature is its speed, then the article needs to provide some usable info about that speed. What the article currently provides is completely unusable.

also -- just for the record, I think I am right and the wiki and AKB are wrong -- any horses ever killed that were attributed to "drowning" were, in fact, killed by fall damage from jumping into the water from too high. Horses cannot drown and anyone who thinks they can hasn't tested it enough. — Unsigned comment by Bewing (talk • contribs) at 21:19 on 30 September 2013

You're welcome to your own opinions, but you should know that we have policies which dictate what does and does not belong on the wiki. AKB and I are both intimately familiar with these policies, so you shouldn't be so quick to dismiss our advice. The reason the sandbox was suggested was because your edits will likely be reverted unless the community decides that they should stay. We always defer to popular opinion for matters of debate, so you should make your case on the talk page for the horses article if you think something should be changed. You should also be careful in how you word your responses, as you're coming across as a bit confrontational. I advise you to review our policies, particularly the etiquette policy, as it will save both you and us a lot of trouble down the line. ThuumofReason (talk) 01:04, 1 October 2013 (GMT)